Topic: Process emotion through the body?

Adam, I take 2 grams of niacin right before going to sleep. Don't take time release; you want the niacin flush because it will smooth out all those sensations you are feeling.

pain in upperarms and/or mental fatigue = sadness/depression ?

pain in upperarms and/or mental fatigue = sadness/depression ?

the connection between pain in upper arms, mental fatigue and depression?

I told you that I think I will get power from the kiss of the most beautiful woman in the world and you replied I am blind due to emotions. But I do not have any emotions, she is the most beautiful woman in the world, receiving a kiss from such a woman triggers the neuron cells and has such an effect according to neurology and more or less this fact is confirmed by observations and common sense.

Now you claim that depression and mental fatigue cause pain in upper arms. Is this what happens to you due to your being constantly mentally tired and depressed and due to your jerking off so as to be celibate forever?

But it is true you delusional freak. If she hugs and kisses me, then magical things will happen. I also found out that she is no guilty of first degree, as a flower told me the answer. The flower would not lie about the Queen of the flowers. But the bastard premeditated the scam and was the cause of my walking away from the chance of my getting a taste of her perfection will undergo the consequences of a fraudulent bastard satisfying lower instincts and motivated by jealousy. And now rationale simulates a real emotion on me. Do you get it paranoid freak? I bet you don't.

Fuck off arsehole and stop stalking people on this forum. You don't have Alexithymia, you're not even posting about it, so piss off and go away. I've reported you for online stalking

I think emotions/feelings in large part are the sum of bodily sensations associated with them, not some undefinable abstract idea that we just don't get.
At the very least, physical sensations are a good proxy for emotions.

This got me thinking, and after some research I found this post, which might be helpful http://kalimunro.com/wp/articles-info/emotions-and-feelings/feelings-identifying-how-you-feel
There's also this research paper, which I don't think is as useful for helping identify emotion, but rather lends some credence to the idea that emotions are largely felt in the body https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3896150/

As for the depression/upper arm pain - I hadn't made the connection before, but I definitely experience some unpleasant tension in my neck/shoulders/arms when feeling particularly down, there might be something to it. It would also fit with how sad people are commonly described as slumping their shoulders.

Like you, I try to correlate bodily sensations to emotions with the help of idioms/proverbs; I also find that old traditional folk songs often provide good descriptions of typically (and locally) accepted correlations. The links you have provided are quite interesting and informative. There is, however, a relatively more recent research article (Shah et al, 2016) that associates Alexithymia with atypical interoception i.e. with atypical sensitivity to stimuli that originate from inside of the body. So this would suggest that those with Alexithymia traits should take the info provided on those links with a grain of salt. However, knowing what is typical is a good step towards self-awareness: so thank you for providing the links!

Here is a link to mentioned article (Shah et al, 2016): https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4962768/

sorry, I mean Edgars not Edward.

If things are correlated with emotions, then the motivation of creating things and emotions are also correlated.
For example, if you correlate the emotions of a mother regarding her child with a movie character, then her attitude might be regarded as acceptable and justified (as it is common and movies derive from real life), but the motivation of the movie is the profit. The same holds true for the motivation of the mother's creation of emotions, which reveals that the mother does not relate herself to the movie character with a view to explaining things and her own attitude, but she intends to gain her own profit, like covering her own needs, while she is indifferent to her child.

I only just yesterday stumbled upon this whole alexithymia thing, and it has been fascinating going through this wealth of new ideas and seeing how much of it applies to me.

I have to wonder how much of the difference in interoception ability is due to habits.
Like, it might very well be the case that if one experiences a prolonged period of mainly negative emotions, they subconsciously or consciously start to tune out the negative feelings (I understand this is the trauma hypothesis of alexithymia). Since neural pathways weaken with disuse, this would leave them less able to notice emotions even when actively trying to - basically one could just be unskilled/out of practice in noticing emotions.
This would only apply if interoception is weakened or strengthened, not straight up incorrect, however this seems to be consistent at least with the Shah et al paper.

I also wonder how much of this might be explained by lack of vocabulary - like, if I would have to list possible human emotions, I can't come up with many off the top of my head. Maybe actively studying emotional vocabulary and making a conscious effort to label your feelings can diminish alexithymia. Do you know of any research in this direction?

In fact, now that I think of it, this also relates to mindfulness mediation. At least in the specific case of Headspace.com, at the start of every session one of the things you do is scan through your body noticing all physical sensations, and then try to label the overall mood you're in(which incidentally I find rather difficult when I don't meditate regularly).

Z - i'm not sure I understand your point, could you clarify?

and how they try to relate irrelevant things to justify their narcissism.

Psychopaths are alexithymic, and malignant narcissists are psychopaths. Alexithymia is a "spectrum", like autism. Narcissists, and psychopaths are also on a spectrum; they probably have a range of alexithymic traits that correlate to their level of narcissism, or psychopathy.

I've found from posts on this site that comorbid Alexithymia usually results in a high score on this site's test, and usually indicates very shallow emotions.

Psychopathy includes many mental illnesses. Narcissism is specific mental illness. According to your definitions, alexithymia includes many mental illnesses.

So you said: Psychopathy includes many mental illnesses and narcissism includes many mental illnesses. Narcissism and psychopathy includes many mental illnesses, so narcissism and psychopathy must be the same with alexithymia.

There are many trees in the forest. There are many trees in my backyard. I saw many trees near the sea. So the forest and my backyard must be the same with the sea.
There is light in the building. There is light in the sky. So the building must be the same with the sky.

Watch out, because such statements move near a specific mental wavelength and it is not "alexithymia".

Z, there are 9 traits that define narcissism. If you have all 9 traits then you are a malignant narcissist (somebody has to have at least 5 of the traits to be labeled a narcissist), and by definition are also a psychopath; got this from some YouTube videos by Dr. Sam Vaknin (the author of several books on narcissism). BTW, there is a YouTube video where Sam Vaknin is diagnosed by a psychologist, and he makes the minimal score for being a psychopath (and was already a self admitted narcissist before the testing).

I didn't say that Alexithymia contains several mental illnesses, but that Alexithymia is comorbid with several conditions; notably, autism, psychopathy, and schizophrenia. I wasn't thinking about narcissism when I started posting on this thread, but when you brought it up I thought, yes narcissists are also alexithymic and malignant narcissists are also psychopaths (which are also alexithymic).

Mercedes Benz has four wheels. A supermarket cart has four wheels. So Mercedes Benz is a supermarket cart.
No, narcissists are not alexithymic (one thing) and I don't know if alexithymia is comorbid with narcissism (another thing).
You cannot equalize narcissism and alexithymia with psychopathy and schizophrenia, because they have or may have some common traits or symptoms.They differ in severity and in way more serious concepts than simple traits/symptoms.
For example, psychopaths and severe mental illnesses are characterized by amoralism, while narcissists and alexithymics have the sense of right and wrong.

The statistic I heard for autism is that 85% of autistics also have Alexithymia; it's a comorbid trait. I don't know the actual statistic for Narcissism, but the fact that malignant narcissists are also psychopaths, means that at least some narcissists have Alexithymia. Alexithymia is so common in so many conditions that I'm guessing it pretty prevalent in narcissism, especially when you consider that narcissism is associated with low levels of empathy.

Z, you are trying to make an analogy about something I am not saying. E.g., Mercedes Benz cars have windows and houses have windows; this does not imply that Mercedes Benz cars are houses. Saying that Alexithymia is comorbid with several other conditions is not implying that those conditions are the same condition.

If you don't think that narcissists have Alexithymia, then why do you post about them on a site that's about Alexithymia?

I gave an example to describe that everything cannot be correlated with everything, the example happened to be about narcissism.
Alexithymia and other illnesses/disorders may be cormobid with other illnesses/disorders (maybe with a simple cold), they may also have common traits with other illnesses/disorders, which I don't know, but they are absolutely distinct from each other. I used absurd tautologies as analogies to show you that you are using absurd tautologies. In any case, it is not my business.

...,"...they are absolutely distinct from each other. "; that is my point about Alexithymia being comorbid in several conditions - it is a separate condition that manifests itself differently in say, autistics versus psychopaths. The Alexithymia in an autistic can be the result of very shallow emotions (it often isn't, but it can be); emotions in psychopaths are usually very shallow, but they are not autistic. Autisitics usually have a very large amygdala and a very small corpus callosum; this causes problems that result in social awkwardness. 85% of autisitics also have Alexithymia, so they also have problems "reading" people. Psychopaths also have an irregularity with the Amygdala, but it is different from an autistic configuration (I think this is the reason for their lack of morality). Psychopaths also have Alexithymia (shallow emotions; not representative of all alexithymics, but common) which when combined with a lack of morality allows psychopaths to be "psychopathic".

Z, I didn't state any tautologies, so don't insult me by saying I used "absurd tautologies" just because you didn't understand my post.

Z, I didn't state any tautologies, so don't insult me by saying I used "absurd tautologies" just because you didn't understand my post.

[quote] 1. Psychopaths are alexithymic, and 2. malignant narcissists are psychopaths. 3. Alexithymia is a "spectrum", like autism. Narcissists, and psychopaths are also on a spectrum; they probably have a range of alexithymic traits that correlate to their level of narcissism, or psychopathy.

I've found from posts on this site that comorbid Alexithymia usually results in a high score on this site's test, and usually indicates very shallow emotions.

Z, there are 9 traits that define narcissism.4. If you have all 9 traits then you are a malignant narcissist (somebody has to have at least 5 of the traits to be labeled a narcissist), and by definition are also a psychopath; got this from some YouTube videos by Dr. Sam Vaknin (the author of several books on narcissism). BTW, there is a YouTube video where Sam Vaknin is diagnosed by a psychologist, and he makes the minimal score for being a psychopath (and was already a self admitted narcissist before the testing).

I didn't say that Alexithymia contains several mental illnesses, but that Alexithymia is comorbid with several conditions; notably, autism, psychopathy, and schizophrenia. I wasn't thinking about narcissism when I started posting on this thread, but when you brought it up I thought, 5. yes narcissists are also alexithymic and 6. malignant narcissists are also psychopaths (which are also alexithymic).

The statistic I heard for autism is that 85% of autistics also have Alexithymia; it's a comorbid trait. I don't know the actual statistic for Narcissism, but the fact that malignant narcissists are also psychopaths, means that at least some narcissists have Alexithymia. Alexithymia is so common in so many conditions that I'm guessing it pretty prevalent in narcissism, especially when you consider that narcissism is associated with low levels of empathy.

Z, you are trying to make an analogy about something I am not saying. E.g., Mercedes Benz cars have windows and houses have windows; this does not imply that Mercedes Benz cars are houses. Saying that Alexithymia is comorbid with several other conditions is not implying that those conditions are the same condition.

If you don't think that narcissists have Alexithymia, then why do you post about them on a site that's about Alexithymia?



Z, I didn't state any tautologies, so don't insult me by saying I used "absurd tautologies" just because you didn't understand my post.

So you wrote 6 absurd tautologies. I understood that you are autistic, but please do not insult me by deliberately misinterpreting my good will to point out your absurd tautologies.

Those lines you block quoted are all taken from accepted definitions and empirical statistics. Take a look at http://www.nature.com/tp/journal/v3/n7/full/tp201361a.html where you can read about how Alexithymia is comorbid with other conditions.

There are several definitions of a tautology, but they all refer to verbal redundancy or circular logic; e.g., Making predictions about the future. Quoting a definition or a statistic is not a tautology.

Z, your comments are all things you have made up; maybe you view them as observations. You don't demonstrate any "book" knowledge/

You tried to make some analogies that didn't follow the logic of my statements.


What I'm saying is that you don't seem very educated. Z, are you 15 (or still in public school)?

Tautology: A tautology is a logical statement in which the conclusion is equivalent to the premise. More colloquially, it is formula in propositional calculus which is always true.
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Tautology.html

For absurd tautology, where logical put absurd and where true put false.

Delusion: An acute mental disturbance characterized by confused thinking and disrupted attention usually accompanied by disordered speech and hallucinations.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/delusion

Examples have already been given.

Mathematically, you have an OR condition where one of the operands is always true.

You didn't answer my original question as to why you are posting about Narcissism on a site about Alexithymia, if you don't believe Narcissists are alexithymic.

Now you haven't answered my question about you being 15. Did I guess your age correctly?

1. A delusion is a fixed belief that does not change even with conflicting evidence. This means that, even if you try reason through a delusion with the person who has one, his belief will not change. When you present a variety of evidence to contradict the delusion, this person will still affirm the belief.

2. Grandiose delusions are delusions with the theme of having an unrecognized talent, insight, or discovery. Persons with grandiose delusions are convinced of their own uniqueness such as having an important role or other powers or abilities. They may also believe themselves to be a famous celebrity or think they have invented something fanatic such as a time machine.

http://www.wikihow.com/Recognize-Delusional-Disorders

3. Unusual repetitive behaviors and/or a tendency to engage in a restricted range of activities are another core symptom of autism. Common repetitive behaviors include hand-flapping, rocking, jumping and twirling, arranging and rearranging objects, and repeating sounds, words, or phrases. Sometimes the repetitive behavior is self-stimulating, such as wiggling fingers in front of the eyes.

https://www.autismspeaks.org/what-autism/symptoms